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Last post 8 days ago by rfenst. 9 replies replies.
Supreme Court’s delays on Jan. 6 are disconcerting
rfenst Online
#1 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,368
It's taking too long IMO. Make the decision and publish it now so that if Trump gets immunity as he claims, we can shut down certain cases and move on...


"Donald Trump’s legal strategy seems to be to try to delay trial of the Jan. 6 case long enough so that he can win the 2024 presidential election and then order the Department of Justice to dismiss the prosecution, or else pardon himself. The U.S. Supreme Court has played into his strategy by unduly delaying the appeal of the immunity issue.

The District Court denied Trump’s immunity motion last Dec. 1. Trump appealed on Dec. 7. The government attempted to expedite the appeal process by asking the Supreme Court to review the immunity issue immediately. The Supreme Court refused, forcing the appeal to proceed through the Court of Appeals.

The Court of Appeals expedited the appeal by requiring briefs to be filed quickly enough to decide the case in four weeks. Nonetheless, 57 days were consumed going through the Court of Appeals even though its review was of dubious benefit in a case of first impression on which the Supreme Court already had the 48-page decision by the District Court.

The Court of Appeals further expedited the case by effectively giving Trump only six days to file in the Supreme Court. The Trump attorneys filed on the sixth day.

The government responded in two days asking the Supreme Court either to refuse the case or to expedite briefing and argument, but the Supreme Court took two weeks to decide to review the case. And the Supreme Court ordered briefing on a schedule that was 25 days longer than the government requested. It gave the Trump attorneys 20 days to brief an issue that they had already briefed seven times.

The Supreme Court has set oral argument for April 25. We can only hope that the court decides the case promptly.
So far the Supreme Court has delayed the Jan. 6 prosecution three times: by requiring review by the Court of Appeals; by taking 16 days to decide to review the case; and by extending the briefing schedule by almost a month.

A simple way of analyzing the delay is to count the days of delay that are directly attributable to the Supreme Court: 93, or more than three months.

To whatever extent there might be experts on expedited review, I can qualify. I was part of the team that represented Gerry Cheevers when the Boston Bruins tried to enjoin him from jumping to the Cleveland Crusaders of the World Hockey Association. After the District Court decided the case in his favor, the Court of Appeals directed simultaneous briefing of the Bruins’ appeal in three days and oral argument two days later; and it decided the case a week after oral argument.
As the events in the Jan. 6 case unfolded, I kept thinking that the appellate schedule was being unnecessarily extended. Closer analysis of the schedule confirmed that impression.

[h]The role of the Supreme Court in creating the delay is disconcerting. The court expedited review of the Colorado case removing Trump from the ballot; it has delayed review of the Jan. 6 case.

The Supreme Court’s actions as a whole create a disturbing impression that the court is supporting Trump’s delay tactics. If there is some good explanation, the court owes it to the nation to explain. We the people deserve to have confidence in the integrity of the judicial process, and most importantly of all, in our Supreme Court.
"




Orlando Sentinel
John Silas “Si” Hopkins III is a longtime attorney with experience in high-end trial and appellate practice. He lives in DeLand.
jeebling Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 08-04-2015
Posts: 1,298
So much to be said about this but I’ll keep it narrowed to one observation. It seems like when the judicial system doesn’t respond to the Democrats demands, then the court is accused of colluding with Trump. The judiciary doesn’t owe any explanations for operating within the bounds of the law and precedent, IMHO. Any defendant preparing to brief SCOTUS should be afforded all the allotted time that any other defendant has, regardless of how many times they have given the brief before other courts or in other circumstances. That is how the justice system works, without favoritism or bias, and every defendant gets the same treatment regardless of election schedules or grand political schemes. I wish this was over and forgotten but going before SCOTUS to determine one man’s personal fate and the rights of the people to choose who they vote for are at stake is a big deal, to put it clumsily. That is just an observation I have and I’m open to hearing any reasonable criticism.
ZRX1200 Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
I hope it stalls till after the election and we get a right wing turn in every single alphabet agency and the left can be illegally lied about, spied upon and set up at every turn.

I’ll complain about it then too, but I’ll at least get a little laugh out of it.
jeebling Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 08-04-2015
Posts: 1,298
Concur. Even if they don’t lie and spy I’ll be very happy. Depleting the government of political hatchet men, perjurers, frauds and kamikaze ideologues would cause enough suffering in the postmodern camp to keep us entertained for awhile.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,513
The GOP is such a ball of confusion I don't see them being able to do any of what you guys are describing. As much as I want there to be retribution I look at how the party handled itself after Trump won the top seat. They acted like they'd never been on the stage before. Disgraceful.

The weaponization of our intelligence community, the DOJ as well as their own party bailing off the ship show me that it's a fool's game to expect anything useful from them. Maybe Trump IF he wins is able to whip them into some coalescence to even want to do something for the nation, much less for their party's survival.
rfenst Online
#6 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,368
jeebling wrote:
So much to be said about this but I’ll keep it narrowed to one observation. It seems like when the judicial system doesn’t respond to the Democrats demands, then the court is accused of colluding with Trump. The judiciary doesn’t owe any explanations for operating within the bounds of the law and precedent, IMHO. Any defendant preparing to brief SCOTUS should be afforded all the allotted time that any other defendant has, regardless of how many times they have given the brief before other courts or in other circumstances. That is how the justice system works, without favoritism or bias, and every defendant gets the same treatment regardless of election schedules or grand political schemes. I wish this was over and forgotten but going before SCOTUS to determine one man’s personal fate and the rights of the people to choose who they vote for are at stake is a big deal, to put it clumsily. That is just an observation I have and I’m open to hearing any reasonable criticism.


I read the trial Order, appellate Opinion and the parties' Briefs. I also listened to the entire SCOTUS Hearing. Despite disagreeing with your political assessment: Yes, it is a big deal. But, we need it over with- promptly- no matter what the outcome. Closure is what is important here.

Appeal on an issue from a trial court is limited solely to the issue(s) ruled on by the trial court- nothing else or new. The same applies to an appeal from appellate court(s). So, basically, there is a limited number of documents and arguments from the trial court and appellate court(s) and Orders and Opinion(s) to read. Nothing else. No new issues; no new evidence or matters.

This is almost completely, a very narrow, issue of law- without precedent. That makes writing an appeal brief much, much simpler. That makes preparing for oral argument much, much easier. That makes ruling by an intermediate appellate court much, much easier. Exactly the same for SCOTUS.

In this day and age of word processing ,one secretary and one lawyer should be able to turn the trial filings into an appellate brief very easily. After the appellate court(s) Opine(s), you are only limited to what you filed/argued in trial court and on appeal. The record from the trial court(s) limit(s) what you can argue before SCOTUS. Again, this makes things much, much easier. Here, both Trump, the U.S. and SCOTUS, have at least a half-dozen lawyers each working on this. Turn-around time on any documents should be negligible. They are probably the smartest of the smartest.

As to SCOTUS, each member has already read everything multiple times over and has a staff of attorneys and secretaries to handle support and everything else promptly. There is no shortage of brainpower or workers in this case. Even more so, the smartest of the smartest are the only one's involved. Trump and the U.S. probably have 5-10 lawyers each working on this. Plenty of brain power and resources. SCOTUS can simply affirm it in whole or part or reject it in whole or part. That's it. Not very difficult, IMO.

And, don't kid yourself. Almost every one of the SCOTUS Justices already knew how they would vote ahead of time in this particular case- and just used the oral argument questioning to solidify or reject what they already know or to teach/argue with other SCOTUS Justices through the answers from both sides' lawyers. I bet they have already by now voted internally, and have decided the outcome. The Opinions just need to be written up and concluded. It could be as simple as stating that the ruling of the trial court and intermediary trial court are simply Affirmed. That would end the SCOTUS case immediately. Or, they could simply overturn the trial and appellate court just as easily. Finally, they could "split the baby from the bathwater" and make a prompt, but mixed ruling of assents, dissents and concurrences. Not difficult at all in such a national/ election important matter.

In Bush v. Gore, they ruled very fast because of its importance. I hope they will do so here too. Should be relatively easy-peasy for them IMO...
rfenst Online
#7 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,368
DrMaddVibe wrote:
The GOP is such a ball of confusion I don't see them being able to do any of what you guys are describing. As much as I want there to be retribution I look at how the party handled itself after Trump won the top seat. They acted like they'd never been on the stage before. Disgraceful.

The weaponization of our intelligence community, the DOJ as well as their own party bailing off the ship show me that it's a fool's game to expect anything useful from them. Maybe Trump IF he wins is able to whip them into some coalescence to even want to do something for the nation, much less for their party's survival.

I am not so sure I don't agree. Our entire government and the politics of our society have gone to $hit.
jeebling Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 08-04-2015
Posts: 1,298
rfenst wrote:
I read the trial Order, appellate Opinion and the parties' Briefs. I also listened to the entire SCOTUS Hearing. Despite disagreeing with your political assessment: Yes, it is a big deal. But, we need it over with- promptly- no matter what the outcome. Closure is what is important here.

Appeal on an issue from a trial court is limited solely to the issue(s) ruled on by the trial court- nothing else or new. The same applies to an appeal from appellate court(s). So, basically, there is a limited number of documents and arguments from the trial court and appellate court(s) and Orders and Opinion(s) to read. Nothing else. No new issues; no new evidence or matters.

This is almost completely, a very narrow, issue of law- without precedent. That makes writing an appeal brief much, much simpler. That makes preparing for oral argument much, much easier. That makes ruling by an intermediate appellate court much, much easier. Exactly the same for SCOTUS.

In this day and age of word processing ,one secretary and one lawyer should be able to turn the trial filings into an appellate brief very easily. After the appellate court(s) Opine(s), you are only limited to what you filed/argued in trial court and on appeal. The record from the trial court(s) limit(s) what you can argue before SCOTUS. Again, this makes things much, much easier. Here, both Trump, the U.S. and SCOTUS, have at least a half-dozen lawyers each working on this. Turn-around time on any documents should be negligible. Most are probably the smartest of the smartest.

As to SCOTUS, each member has already read everything multiple times over and has a staff of attorneys and secretaries to handle support and everything else promptly. There is no shortage of brainpower or workers in this case. Trump and the U.S. probably have 5-10 lawyers each working on this. Plenty of brain power and resources. SCOTUS can simply affirm it in whole or part or reject it in whole or part. That's it. Not very difficult, IMO.

And, don't kid yourself. Almost every one of the SCOTUS Justices already knew how they would vote ahead of time in this particular case- and just used the oral argument questioning to solidify or reject what they already know or to teach/argue with other SCOTUS Justices through the answers from both sides' lawyers. I bet they have already decided the outcome and the Opinions just need to be written up and concluded.

In Bush v. Gore, they ruled very fast because of its importance. I hope they will do so here too. Should be relatively easy-peasy for them IMO...


That is a worthy opinion. I don’t think it rises to justification of railroading a defendant for political expediency. Easy is not always best or fair for both parties who are actually in the fight.
rfenst Online
#9 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,368
jeebling wrote:
... I don’t think it rises to justification of railroading a defendant for political expediency. Easy is not always best or fair for both parties who are actually in the fight.

I don't necessarily agree, but understand your perspective/point. IMO, both parties will get a fair shot here. I just don't see any reason for unnecessary delay. Everyone needs closure on this promptly.
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